Monday, November 4, 2013

BaZi: SMTH - 胞胎逢印绶 In womb seeing Seal and ribbon


This structure belongs to a few day pillars with Seal as the Month EB, when the DM sits on weak Qi, 胞胎 BaoTai, In womb refers to the stages of  Jue and Tai of 12 Qi phase.

胞 Bao - refers to the time of receiving Qi, the stage of Extinction, Jue. It's like a zygote that is just formed.
胎 Tai - refers to the time in Womb, like an embryo or fetus.

When DM sits on these EBs, it's Qi is extremely weak, and that makes Seal a very favorable element, much more when it's in the month EB. This follows the concept of 有情, having affection. 

According to the text, the pillars of BaoTai are Geng Yin, Xin Mao, Bing Shen, Yi You etc. But usually there are 10 pillars that are usually regarded as BaoTai pillars

They are 

甲申、Jia Shen - Jia sits on Jue Qi stage
乙酉、Yi You - Yi sits on Jue
丙子、Bing Zi - Bing sits on Tai
丁亥、Ding Wei - Ding sits on Tai
戊子、Wu Zi - Wu sits on Jue
己亥、Ji Hai - Ji sits on Tai
庚寅、Geng Yin - Geng sits on Jue
辛卯、Xin Mao - Xin sits on Tai
壬午、Ren Wu - Ren sits on Tai
癸未,   Gui Wei - Gui sits on Mu (why Mu I have no idea)

I believe Bing Shen in SMTH could be a typo because Bing Shen is Bing sitting on Bing (sickness). 

Any chart that falls into this structure favors Officer, 7K and Seal in the LP, it denotes great nobility (sort of like getting a very high position in one's employment) 


  1. Dear Trey,

    Will the chart below qualify as the Womb meeting Seal structure

    Ren Ding Wu Geng
    Zi Hai Yin Zi

    Ding DM sitting on Tai with Seal in month EB and heavy water. DM has been in Senior position since young but in small to mid size company only. Earn enough for a relatively comfortable life but cannot be considered rich.

    As Wu protrudes on stem, I have always thought that this is one of those structures where HO is controlled by Seal. (HO adorn with Seal??). I felt that Geng will not affect Seal is it is too weak on the chart and probably the reason why DM cannot accumulate wealth.

    What structure would you consider this chart to be ?

  2. Hi Joe,

    Ren Ding Wu Geng
    Zi Hai Yin Zi


    I think it qualifies as In womb meeting Seal, but at the same time it uses Officer. 逢印看官。

    Direct Seal structure, protruding HO is controlled by Seal itself thus is not able to hurt Ren Officer.

    Geng Wealth would be inauspicious as it counters Seal but at the same time it mediates HO with DO.

    HO adorned with Seal is only when HO is the Month Command, like Jia born in Wu.

    He will be okay if LP goes places where Officer and Seal are prosperous.


  3. Dear Trey,

    Thks for your reply. A few books I read said that for a Ding DM born in Yin month, if Wu is the only element on the stem, then it is a HO structure. I thought this is the guideline to determine a chart structure.

    If Wu is not considered strong in spring, then what if Bing appears on the stem? Will the chart then be considered as a RW structure instead of a Seal structure?

  4. Dear Joe,

    My first analysis was like yours, a Hurting Officer adorns with Seal structure, as Wu protruding from Yin would change the structure from Seal to HO (ZPZQ), with Seal at the month EB, it would be adoring Seal.

    But then, as I go through the literatures, I saw all examples of HOawS structures are 'True HO' structures like Jia born in Wu or Wu born in You.

    Then I reconsidered my viewpoint and referred to SFTK,

    which lists out the possible chart structure for the Ding DM.

    My other reason for thinking that this is a Seal structure is because of the Yin Hai combination to Wood, I believe this transformation would retain the original structure and prevent the change to HO structure.

    Anyway, I thought both structures (HO structure adorns with Seal or Seal structure controlling HO and saving Officer) don't favor Wealth breaking the Seal, as Seal is needed to protect the Officer. This conforms to the saying 有官先论官,无官方论用。 If there's Officer analyze the Officer first, if there's no Officer, only then analyze the 'Use' (Useful God)

    [If Wu is not considered strong in spring, then what if Bing appears on the stem? Will the chart then be considered as a RW structure instead of a Seal structure? ]

    I believe so, if Bing protrudes, with Wu, the structure would jumbles up, and what should be analyze as what would be unclear, thus it is not a noble structure.

  5. time day month year
    乙 乙 壬 壬
    酉 酉 子 子

    Hi Trey,

    Is the above considered 胞胎逢印绶? kindly advice.

  6. hello trey, can you help me distinguish, if i have the seal or ribbon structure in my chart :)

    wu wu geng wu
    wu zi shen yin